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Author Topic: 2007 Electric Pylon Racing  (Read 17606 times)
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Gene Bond
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« on: February 05, 2006, 08:26:30 PM »

We have been working on trying to set up a fun pylon racing series for this season. We decided on a 'spec' plane that won't break the bank, and are trying to pin down a set of simple and effective rules to keep it fun, yet allow some leeway for the guys that want to try to make a decent plane even better.

Following are the preliminary rules. They will be shown and discussed at the February meeting. I thought it might be nice to 'let the cat out of the bag' a week early, and possibly get some input or see if there are any details that are not clear.
============================================================================

Electric Pylon Racing Rules
(V1.1- 6/9/06)

These rules are to allow Club racing in an enjoyable, competitive, low-cost format.

Aircraft: All aircraft must be the stock GWS F-4U Corsair ($56)(http://www.horizonhobby.com/Shop/ByCategory/Product/Default.aspx?ProdID=GWS1065 ): No modifications allowed to airframe, except Stock spar material can be changed. Landing gear is not required, but may be used. The Slope Glider Version ($30)( http://www.horizonhobby.com/Shop/ByCategory/Product/Default.aspx?ProdID=GWS1067 ) is available for a spare airframe.

Motor: Any Stock GWS EPS-300 or 350 geared motor is allowed. ($17) (The kits are inconsistent in which motor and ratio is shipped, and this will allow guys to play with ratios and props.) *** update *** The outrunner we chose is in stock at Hobby RC. The battery rules remain, 8xNi or 2sLiPo.
This motor is best run with an E-Flite 9x7.5 prop and 8xKAN700 (2/3A size cells). Barb also stocks these.
Battery: 8 cell NiMh or NiCd or 2 cell LiPo. Size is open.

Prop: Open

Saftety: AMA standard Pylon safety regulations will apply. This means a ‘bump cap’ (http://www.grainger.com/Grainger/wwg/itemDetailsRender.shtml?xi=xi&ItemId=1613548098 ) as a minimum.

Racing: Course is 2 pylons, 250-275 feet apart, parallel to the main runway.

The field of planes will be divided into heats, with a maximum of 5 planes per heat.

2 pylon judges are located behind the flight line perpendicular to the pylons. Starter and Scorekeeper will control the start and count laps for all aircraft.

A hand launch start is conducted with a countdown to “zero” announced to the pilots. 10 laps constitute a heat and must be flown by each aircraft in order to finish the heat.

Cutting a pylon is a loss of a lap. After 2 cuts a pilot is finished.

Mid-air collisions result in both aircraft landing immediately.

The heats will be shuffled between rounds, 3 rounds minimum.

Scoring: 1st place = 4 points, 2nd place = 3 points, 3rd place = 2 points, 4th place = 1 point. No points if plane did not finish.

Motors and batteries of the top finishers can be and will be checked for “stock” condition.

Rule Changes: (yes, there may be some at some point!) A race will be run with the rules as they have been stated prior to that race. There will be no changes to the rules until after all racing is completed at the current race. Any modifications to the rules will be addressed in a Pilot’s meeting after the race concludes and awards are distributed. No modifications to these rules will be done without 100% agreement of those registered Pilots attending a race. Any changes to the rules that are the result of the Pilots meeting would take effect starting at the next race.

(Updated 6-19-06 & 8-28-07)
« Last Edit: March 15, 2008, 11:24:42 PM by Pat » Logged
ColonelG
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« Reply #1 on: February 18, 2006, 05:52:45 PM »

Gene,

I really think that this can be fun.  I'm not that good a stick with the little electrics, but I think if I can avoid a crash that I would probably finish somewhere in the middle.  With the longer hours of daylight this year we should be able to get out after dinner and practice flying this plane.

Chuck G
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Gene Bond
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« Reply #2 on: February 19, 2006, 10:45:23 PM »

Hey, the middle of the pack is going to be crowded! I don't anticipate being among the top finishers, by any stretch... IF I finish, I'll be setting a slow pace Smiley

I intend to do a bunch of testing and post my suggestions here. My plane should be complete theis week.
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Chuck Baker
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« Reply #3 on: February 20, 2006, 10:56:07 AM »

Gene,

I've been thinking a lot about this lately.

As you know, I already have a GWS Corsair kit, but am reluctant to build it with the stock motor, given my experience with the stock motor set up on the GWS Me-109.  Yeah, it would fly, but I wouldn't want to fly pylon with it.  Give it just a little too much elevator and you'd be rewarded with a snap roll (high speed stall).

I really think you should consider racing Slow Sticks.  There are a lot more members in the club that have Slow Sticks than there are GWS warbirds.  Besides, Slow Sticks are cheaper, easier to repair and probably even more durable than the GWS Corsair would be.

Yes, I know that the Slow Stick would be affected by the wind, but to be honest, I'd fly my Slow Stick in more wind than I'd fly my GWS Me-109 in.

The other advantage is that it is easier to swap out drive systems on the Slow Stick than the Corsair.  In addition, it'll be easier to inspect a motor/ESC/battery combo on the Slow Stick, since it's hanging out in the breeze.  Speaking of which, it'll also help keep everything cooler than it would be in the Corsair.

Now, the only question is, will you allow Slow Sticks with modified wings?  Although it's true that the low dihedral aileron-equipped Slow Stick will handle a bit better in the wind, it's also true that it will be heavier than a stock wing equipped Slow Stick.  Of course if stock wings have to be used, it's only $10 for a spare wing.  Smiley

Just my opinions...
Chuck
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Gene Bond
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« Reply #4 on: February 21, 2006, 07:01:56 AM »

Yes, I suggested SlowSticks to start, but was shot down by several due to the wind thing. I really don't care. We could race IFO's or 3D planes for all it really matters, as long as we all have fun. Hopefully, we can get some good discussion going and come to a concensus.

I'm starting mine tonight, so should be testing in the air towards the end of the week. Being MY first GWS warbird, I am taking a lot on people's word. Let's figure out what's best and run with it.
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« Reply #5 on: February 21, 2006, 01:44:17 PM »

THere's no reason would couldn't have both a slow stick class and a gws class. I know a lot of guys have the slow sticks already, so it might be a little quicker to get going.  I'd assume the wabirds might be better in the wind, but problaby not by much.  Guess we;ll have to stage the races at 6:00 a.m. before the wind picks up. Smiley
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Gene Bond
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« Reply #6 on: February 21, 2006, 04:49:00 PM »

My original thought was a 'modified class', where we would only limit by a 'spec' battery pack or weight, or whatever. Personally, I'd build my own plane, so it would be easily replaced (with new modifications) after I crashed it (each heat?)... Something like 2s1320, or even 2s730 would be fine with me... Want to get crazy? 3s2100??? Cheesy Again, I really don't care as long as it's cheap and fun... I'm easy!
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Gene Bond
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« Reply #7 on: February 22, 2006, 05:24:39 AM »

Just got a suggestion via e-mail. What do you think?

Quote
...  now the real reason for this email. just got the lattest flyer from tower hobbies and gws is now putting the 400 in the slo stick. what does this mean? i don't know that it matters. my proposal, fly pylon fun with stock 300,350,or400 motors limit battery 2cell lipo or 8cell nickel. at first fly sticks and corsairs together as i think initial participation will be weak.if this goes as i hope,more people will participate and two class could be run. my experience tells me the true test will be how many planes show up to race. to maximize this number is why i suggest running both planes. face it, in any competition some will take it to the extreme. for this reason i think prize level should be minimal.the best thing i think we can do is keep this simple,expand to allow sticks,and always remember were just big kids playing with toy airplanes.
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ColonelG
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« Reply #8 on: February 22, 2006, 04:53:47 PM »

Guys,  It sounds like we are all saying about the same thing, "Lets do something that we can have some fun doing that doesn't break the bank."  I also have a Slow-Stick already and would probably be just as happy flying it in the beginning as I would the Cousair.  The only thing I think might be an issue with them is the length of the course and the number of trips around. 
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Pat
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« Reply #9 on: February 22, 2006, 06:19:25 PM »

maybe you should run a poll to see what the over all consensus is Grin
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« Reply #10 on: February 22, 2006, 10:31:37 PM »

A lot of good suggestions/cmts here.  Some comments have a familiar ring back to the days when we were starting Q 500 pylon racing.  Up front, it's sounds logical to let a lot of different types of equipment to be used, in the interest of making it easy on folks who already have planes in hand.  Experience shows however, there is a potential problem with such action.  Rather than starting with some sort of a level playing field, we will have one type plane or another which will prove to be the best suited in terms of speed/handling.  Those with a high "lets have fun" interest, will go out and get whatever proves to work best.  Many who try it with equipment they already have which proves to be less suitable, without any positive feedback concerning performance potential, will decide not to bother.  This is the reason that most clubs with some type of pylon program have standard guidelines, to prevent the "bar" from always changing in terms of equipment, and members getting negative feedback from trying to participate with unsuitable stuff.   

Again, from my experience, the simpler the rules, and more basic/standard the equipment, the better chance we have for doing something that a broader segment of the membership will find fun!

My two cents, we should all fly the same stuff, and I don't have a preference other than something inexpensive, which can also be fun for other sport flying!
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« Reply #11 on: February 25, 2006, 09:43:05 PM »

I'd vote for limitations to powerplant and battery to help jumpstart the activity.  I'd certainly be more interested to participate in this venture if I didn't have to purchase a new plane (not for the cost, it's just another airframe I'd have to store).   Being able to use an airframe I already have, even if I need to replace the powerplant and maybe purchase new batteries is just easier for me.

If this event becomes more popular, I'd agree with Duane that over time, folks who didn't have the best hardware or setup wouldn't have much positive feedback to keep participating.  Perhaps that is when separate classes with additional restrictions are kicked off.
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Gene Bond
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« Reply #12 on: March 01, 2006, 07:43:15 AM »

Got my Corsair done and tested. I like it!

I started with the slope glider kit, since I wanted a different paint scheme, and I have plenty of GWS 300 and 350 motors. I sanded the mold marks and filled the extra holes and recesses with DAP Fast and Final Lightweight Spackling (Wal-Mart). I filled the landing gear slots with some scrap foam. I cut and dremeled out the battery hatch for more room and air flow. I used 2 aileron servos rather than the single servo and torque rods, per the addendum to the manual. See the bottom of this page: http://www.gws.com.tw/english/product/airfly/f4u.htm I did not use the rudder. I changed the elevator to a pull-up, rather than push-up configuration, by moving the pushrod tube above the stab. I filled the extra holes. I taped the leading edge of the wing, and the bottom of the wing and fuse to reduce landing rash.

Throws:
Elevator: +/- 3/8"
Ailerons: +/- 5/8" race (low), +/- 1" sport (high)

The setup I went with:

EPS-350C-C (5.33:1)
9070RS prop
2s1100 LiPo or 8x650 NiMh (2/3AA size)
3 GWS Pico Servos
Hitec Electron 6 rx
Wattage 15a esc (junk, buy a different one, but then again, it's an on/off switch for racing Smiley )
Weight: 13.25 or 15.5 oz

Here's some pictures and video (15M): Click here to watch USCG-Corsair
« Last Edit: March 01, 2006, 12:29:50 PM by Gene Bond » Logged
Gene Bond
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« Reply #13 on: March 01, 2006, 07:48:27 AM »

Looks like we will have a couple of kits, complete with servos, speed control, and a battery pack for the raffle this month!
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« Reply #14 on: March 02, 2006, 04:13:41 PM »

I just sent an E-mail to barb to order the slope glider and motor.  Like Gene I like the idea of a white plane.  Seems like I'm always pushing the end of the day before I can get any flying in.  The white plane will give me a few more flights per day.   I'm in!   Grin

John
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